Question:
Big Bang, Abiogensis and Evolutionary Theory?
2008-06-29 12:28:43 UTC
There is no doubt in the strength of ET, in particular speciest evolution.
As a Christian who accepts this I am curious to know what could disprove The Big Bang or Abiogensis.
I know that proving a 'creator' exists is impossible by design and is therefore not likely to be dis-proven.... but equally so can the scienctific theory of creation be disproven and if so what would do that.
I am genuinely interested in hearing and learning more about the science which opposes my faith.
Eight answers:
Timaeus
2008-06-29 12:38:04 UTC
Science is not opposed to Christian faith. Ideologically driven materialism that uses sceince as a dogmatic schema to justify its prejudices against religion opposes Christian faith.
davy j
2008-06-29 21:11:54 UTC
Perhaps you would be wise to look more closely at your faith - Christianity is an amalgam of ideas and beliefs drawn together and selected into a creed over a period of two millenia. It has solidly opposed any scientific examination of its basic tenets (virgin birth, miracles etc.) and it has not given the world any explanation for the way life works or its complexity. It is not even the most popular religion! Science is essentially a method for examining evidence and it builds upon that evidence to provide a body of knowledge that is testable and verifiable. As a Christian you take on trust and faith a jumble of superstitions and untestable beliefs that do not explain even the smallest detail of how life works. Does the Bible have anything to say about photosynthesis? No. Genetic codes? No. The function of the liver? No. Anything even remotely practical that would offer an explanation of how things actually work? No. Don't worry about trying to disprove the Big Bang, science will do that if sufficient evidence is collected that indicates that the theory doesn't work. Try instead to prove the existence of your Christ using scientific method. Can't do it? At least you will have a rigorous method for testing the evidence. Now look in the Bible and try praying for an explanation as to to why plants have green foliage. Get anything? No...and that's why science is better than Christianity!



Well, well,well, do I hear the noise of a cage being rattled? So you have a faith! Well whoop ti do. And you think that means you can say 'equally so can the scientific theory of creation be disproven'. Well maybe it can and maybe it can't. The point is that it will be scientific method that does it either way. If you want to learn more about science, do it the hard way by educating yourself, don't expect easy answers to come to you as if they were the tenets of a religion. And if you go round talking about 'the science which opposes my faith' expect to be taken to task for sloppy thinking. Any fool can be a Christian, it takes intelligence to be a scientist! Science doesn't oppose any faith, it has more important things to do, like finding out what the universe is really about. Perhaps you should try thinking instead of believing?
?
2008-06-29 20:50:34 UTC
Actually Timaeus, this "dogmatic materialism" you speak of was adopted as a rather practical rule during the enlightenment, to stop people from asking a question and the response being "Well God did it" a rather common response (or some variant thereof) before that period.



And it depends what you mean by disprove the Big Bang. It could certainly be done, we'd just need data to demonstrate that it didn't happen the way it appears to currently. The only issue is that the data we have, especially background radiation appears to completely support this.



As for abiogenesis, evidence only keeps coming in on this (most especially the clay hypothesis proposed recently). I would personally say that you'd need some strong demonstration that life did not arise from non-biological means. What form that would take, I don't know.
R[̲̅ə̲̅٨̲̅٥̲̅٦̲̅]ution
2008-06-29 20:47:28 UTC
By "abiogenesis," I am assuming you are referring to the arisal of life from non-living matter through natural means. I think a big part of the misunderstanding and refusal to accept life emerging from non-life naturally is that most people seem to have an "either-or" view of life: either something is alive, or it isn't. This however ignores the broad range of stuff in between. For instance, there are a number of self-replicating molecules in nature. Can a mere molecule be said to be alive, just because it can make copies of itself? Unless you're an animist who believes everything is alive, the answer to that is probably no. But what if that molecule is a protein? Or a single strip of RNA? Or a strip of RNA encased in a protein coating? Now you're talking about a virus. From there it's not all that far to get to a simple single-celled organism, and from there....



Regarding the big bang theory (btw it's formally called Inflation Theory), its strength is that it fits in so beautifully with what we observe. Any good scientific theory makes testable predictions which can be confirmed or refuted through observations and/or experiments. In the case of Inflation Theory, it makes a number of predictions. It predicts that there should be a background of energy which cools down (redshifts) as the universe expands and ages; we have observed this as the microwave background radiation, and it is at just the temperature we would expect it to be at. The theory also predicts that our universe should have certain ratios of hydrogen to helium, lithium, and other heavier elements, and again, what we've observed dovetails with the theory. Ditto for the distribution pattern of matter throughout the universe.



For more on this, I very highly recommend "The Inflationary Universe" by Alan Guth, one of Inflation Theory's developers. This book does a good job of explaining in layman's terms not only what Inflationary Theory is, but just why it's our best theory in explaining our universe and what tests the theory had to go through to be accepted.



What might disprove a theory is if an observation is made or an experiment done which flies in the face of what the theory says is supposed to be. So for instance if we observed twice as much helium in the universe as we do now, that would be a problem for our current Inflationary Theory. When a theory runs into trouble like that, it must be either modified or chucked out the window. Either way, the process of scientific inquiry is to then find a theory which _does_ explain the observations and/or experimental results.



Science certainly doesn't have all the answers, at least not yet. If it did, then there'd be no more need to do any science, since we'd already know all there is to know. One must be careful, however, not to confuse the fact that science _doesn't_ have the answer to a problem with the assertion that it _cannot_. Science and religion usually come into conflict when one, usually religion, intrudes upon the other's territory. Religion is ok if you're talking about morality or church doctrine, but we need to realize that when it comes to offering verifiable claims about the world around us, that religion's explanations were essentially wild guesses by primitive peoples before the time of science, logic, experimentation, or rational thought. We now know that disease is not demonic possession, that epilepsy is entirely natural and not divine, so too with famines and tsunamis, and that the sun does not orbit the Earth. Every time human knowledge has advanced contrary to religious teachings, there has been conflict between religion and science, but every time, that conflict was unnecessary. So too are the current conflicts over evolution and the origins of our universe.
Karlito
2008-06-30 21:44:41 UTC
Life is not really life, life is just a name that we give to it. From the very first there is neither a thing nor not a thing. Individuality of forms is an illusion. Many people feel fundamentally opposed to this way of thinking because they say it is unhelpful. Look for example at the close relationship between eastern mysticism and quantum physics and especially at their descriptions of space/time and matter/energy. It is striking and beautiful to see such a correspondence between two differing systems of thought, both of which attempt to explain reality.

whatever we call stuff, hydrogen, helium, it is all the very same stuff and indeed so is the stuff that holds the stuff together. A great book is the Tao of Physics, by Fritjof Capra.

This whole thing (cosmos, universe, whatever) has no end and therfore can hardly have had a beginning.
leowin1948
2008-07-01 08:58:46 UTC
There is a lot of difference between a Theory and Law.Theory is an explanation/assumption to explain something.It ned not be proved.The theory can be replaced by another theory.But Lwa like Newton's Law can be proved.Big bang theory is as an explanation for the ever expanding universe.Evolution theory is for explain the evolution of life on earth.Similarly there is no proof for theory of creation .The science does not oppose faith.

Do you know that human sperms cannot fertlize any animal ovum.You can not create hybrid like man- horse,man- bird etc.Human DNA is totally different and as such evolution of man from animals or monkey might not have happened.Man might have come down to Earth from elsewhere(first alien on Earth) or may be a creation of God.
William E
2008-06-30 01:25:51 UTC
I agree with your comments regarding peoples unnecessarily annoying posts. However, to reflect upon you question, perhaps you would like to look again at you motive, your reason or underlying structure that drove you to ask what you have, by consideration to the following…..



Life is term confused.

Consciousness is an illusion by which we base our study to be true, or false.

We are not conscious because we think, it’s because we think, that we believe, well, we must be!

We are all material objects, complex maybe, compared to a brick! Only that consciousness is purely a derivative of that complexity, nothing else!



That makes us not alive, and well not dead, but only by our falsely categorising us, from that brick, can we say that! Because nothing in the universe ever can be, alive, just falsely categorised as so. It also quantifies one other dilemma, that there is now no reason to suggest that anyone or anything created us, least as far back as the big bang theory!



Keeping it short, should you wish, I will explain further. Just have a serious think about the above before making hasty replies.
2008-06-29 19:58:16 UTC
The Big Bang is the point in history when God thought everything into being.


This content was originally posted on Y! Answers, a Q&A website that shut down in 2021.
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